Quest for Insight

[Mister Grafik]

"I get these on just about every plant I grow .yes on feminized on every plant .when they are budding they will start throwing tiny little shitty buds on the lower part of the plant in random spots I always pull them.off as soon as I see them ."

I've got some more insight from a bunch of different people.. Mostly seems to be feminized seed but I don't think that's the issue at all.

I think I might be right about the lighting transition (big picture) ~

[ripper5]

They remind me of what it looks like when re-vegging a plant.

[Prawn Connery]

My theory is a narrowing of the gene pool. More and more of the same strains are being used to create all these new crosses, and a lot of the mutations you are seeing are quite common in original Blueberry lines, so my guess would be that these recessive genes are showing up more frequently due to constant inbreeding of the same genetics. You hardly see any outcrosses these days, and there are no new genetics coming into the pool that I can tell. Blueberry lines have been used heavily in today's strains – I doubt there is a modern strain that doesn't have any Blueberry (or its foundation plants) in it anywhere.

I can tell you it has nothing to do with LEDs, as I have seen these mutations under all kinds of light, including sunlight.

[Mister Grafik]

They remind me of what it looks like when re-vegging a plant.

That is kind of true. THinking of it maybe the lighting theory tricks the plant. Some red is reflecting off the crinkle in the tent causing mutations at the Nodes.... Flowering and reveging flowering and reveging (when it's supposed to be all vegging)

Thanks for that observation Ripper. Much appreciated - I didn't even draw that parallel

[Mister Grafik]

My theory is a narrowing of the gene pool. More and more of the same strains are being used to create all these new crosses, and a lot of the mutations you are seeing are quite common in original Blueberry lines, so my guess would be that these recessive genes are showing up more frequently due to constant inbreeding of the same genetics. You hardly see any outcrosses these days, and there are no new genetics coming into the pool that I can tell. Blueberry lines have been used heavily in today's strains – I doubt there is a modern strain that doesn't have any Blueberry (or its foundation plants) in it anywhere.

I can tell you it has nothing to do with LEDs, as I have seen these mutations under all kinds of light, including sunlight.

I have seen it in sunlight also but the plant was near death and underfed / not well kept.

I think the theory of big picture lighting, trapping the cannabis inside and swapping spectrums over the course of it's abuse...
Makes more sense than constant inbreeding of genetics. I don't think anyone has enough capacity to muddy the pool in such a manner.

only their own pool ~

Nonetheless, thanks for the angle. I hadn't thought about such inbred genetics other than what I see today..
But a gene that is carried throughout a generation can very well pop up.

And to be frank, blueberry is some mids ~ Nothing that stellar about it other than a bunch of people used it to make their own variants.
Same thing with SK1. Used and abused. Mind you, what they did for breeding (or what they undid) is held at very high regards.

Neither of these plants here are Blueberry. The first one is actually known as Beatrix Choice.
Maybe you've heard it?

[Mister Grafik]

In the case people don't know Who or What Beatrix Choice is.

https://en.seedfinder.eu/strain-info/Be ... Seed_Club/

[Prawn Connery]

Original Beatrix Choice? I doubt it. Those genetics go back more than 30 years. Unless someone has been breeding an IBL for the past three decades . . .
Where did you get them and how old were the seeds?

Blueberry is not a "mid". The original Blueberry was made up of genetics that purvey most modern strains today. I grew a SOL plant out in 2002 that was (I believe) Blockhead x Sweet Tooth #3. SWT#3 is half Blueberry (#3 was a backcross, but the original ST was Grapefruit x DJ Short Blueberry). That was the absolute strongest indica I've ever grown. It was a freak. I found it in an Adventure Mix that contained seeds from a bunch of Breeder Steve's clones pollinated by his SWT#3 male, so whatever it was it was 1/4 Blueberry.

I've got a Mental Floss clone here that is half Blueberry F4 and it is up there in terms of strength. It's just a different kind of high that leans more towards the sativa head high type, and not the knock-out indica type. Kids these days really don't know what a good sativa is like anyway. That's pretty much all we had back in the 80s and 90s until all the Dutch indoor genetics permeated everything. I've smoked landrace sativas in Asia that got me as high as I've ever been in my life!

[Mister Grafik]

Original Beatrix Choice? I doubt it. Those genetics go back more than 30 years. Unless someone has been breeding an IBL for the past three decades . . .
Where did you get them and how old were the seeds?

Blueberry is not a "mid". The original Blueberry was made up of genetics that purvey most modern strains today. I grew a SOL plant out in 2002 that was (I believe) Blockhead x Sweet Tooth #3. SWT#3 is half Blueberry (#3 was a backcross, but the original ST was Grapefruit x DJ Short Blueberry). That was the absolute strongest indica I've ever grown. It was a freak. I found it in an Adventure Mix that contained seeds from a bunch of Breeder Steve's clones pollinated by his SWT#3 male, so whatever it was it was 1/4 Blueberry.

I've got a Mental Floss clone here that is half Blueberry F4 and it is up there in terms of strength. It's just a different kind of high that leans more towards the sativa head high type, and not the knock-out indica type. Kids these days really don't know what a good sativa is like anyway. That's pretty much all we had back in the 80s and 90s until all the Dutch indoor genetics permeated everything. I've smoked landrace sativas in Asia that got me as high as I've ever been in my life!

These are from somebody who doesn't wish to be named. Doubt or not, she's pretty neat ~

Mids that's just my opinion. I have never thought blueberry was hot smoke. Never have said do you have any blueberry? Except maybe one time when Ludacris made the rap song called Blueberry Yum Yum.

So then we look at the fact of inbreeding again. If your point of recessive genes coming out from decades of inbreeding is accurate then...
Blueberry is in fact mids expressing those genes.

We'd have to look at the highs and flowers now. The differences are pretty black and white.

Cannabis highs used to be fairly introspective. Reflection and zoning. Opening the mind, not closing it.
If blueberry makes up a large chunk of the pool today, It's unfortunate everyone used the same plants.

And inbreeding over and over bringing out more recessive blueberry trait?
Maybe that's what is causing the boring commercial grade highs and seriously similar flavors across the board.
But I don't want to blame it all on Blueberry. The farmers play a big role in that. The people buying up nutrient companies also..

All the stuff mentioned - beyond people crossing plants - influences genetic. No not over one season, I'm talking big picture.

Thanks for the conversation and comments -
truly, you're very knowledgable and give me more inspiration than you'd think

[Prawn Connery]

I completely agree with you about the generic highs and tastes of today's weed. And if you have noticed, many of the popular strains of today are just remixes of older genetics, especially OG Kush. If you go back far enough, you will find Blueberry in a lot of genetics. And even if Blueberry is not present, you will find the original Afghan and/or Thai and Mexican strains used to create the original Blueberry. Nearly all modern weed goes back to the original building blocks of Afghan and Haze (and yes, there were a few different Afghan and Haze varieties back in the day).

If you keep recombining the same genes over and over, all that happens is that the recessive genes are either compounded (desirable traits) or eliminated (undesirable traits), all of which narrows the gene pool until you end up with pretty generic tasting weed with similar highs.

It's not just weed. Look at any farmed crop and you will see a few varieties dominate nearly every species being grown, be it corn, wheat, potatoes or strawberries. There are something like 4000 different varieties of potato in nature, and yet in Australia maybe 4-5 different types make up most of the potatoes grow here. I remember a German friend of mine complaining about the lack of variety of potatoes in Australia when he was living here, saying most German supermarkets had dozens of different types.

Lack of genetic diversity is what caused the Irish potato famine, among other things.

[Butcher Bob]

Things like leaf buds, triplets etc are also oddity? These cannot be bred - is there some truth to that?

The first I saw the flowers at node sites was on a Faceoff OG. I actually threw it to the grave because I thought it to be a herm..
Now I am seeing it more in subsequent generations... Could it be environmentally influenced? Or is this genetic?

I am puzzled by it - I have several plants showing these things now. But knowing they are not hermie - these are feminized.
It appears to be dominating the pool? That being said, would need to select for the plants showing the most in order to get rid of it ~

Is that the right line of thought? Inherently selecting for those plants?

On another thought, these flowers at the nodes could be taking away from the bud production on the mains..

Flower-Site-Node.jpg

From another place "I always get rid of those extra little.b4anches as soon as they start growing.they will pop up just about everywhere and when in flower they will take energy away from your mail budding sites"

The leaf buds I'm not sure aboot...have seen them many times. In discussions I've seen before, some folks thought it was an indication that you were providing optimal nutrient levels and balance. I'm not so sure aboot that, because most strains never had them, while other strains might have multiple plants in the batch exhibit the phenomenon. Personally, I think it's just an oddity having to do with generic cells at the site.

As for flowers, or extra branch growth, at nodes...this is normal plant behavior. Anyone that has done lollypopping is quite familiar with the constant need to strip this growth during flower, just as the quote you've posted indicates. This is not limited to cannabis, most plants exhibit it as sucker growth...and yes, it steals resources from the rest of the plant. Many fruit crops need to have this type of growth cut off so that it will not adversely affect yields. And unfortunately, once you start stripping it off, it will continue if the wound is not sealed. Wounded spots on plants, like when we do scarification to promote rooting when cloning, signals the plant to start producing generic cells at the site...which can then easily be converted into flower or stem cells. Remember, the plant is just trying to survive and procreate...it does not give a shit aboot the bag appeal you are trying to achieve.