I have done 2 crops in amended pro mix bx.
Only organic nutrients were added. bone meal, blood meal, guano, worm castings. I did add some Cal Max when watering because they had yellow tips beginning.
I have found some opinions that say that is it, I can't use it any more.
What say ye?
The limits of Pro-mix
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Lrus007
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The limits of Pro-mix
well with pro mix
i found that it would make big buds but light.
just no weight to them. i added stuff also at the time.
that was a long time ago when i used it for growing.
i do use it still for clones mixed with worm castings.
at this time i am using black gold and worm castings
for my mix. heavy on the castings from my worm bin.
hope this helps in some way.
Lrus007
ps. look at potting soil, if it has any wood chips in it do not buy it...
i found that it would make big buds but light.
just no weight to them. i added stuff also at the time.
that was a long time ago when i used it for growing.
i do use it still for clones mixed with worm castings.
at this time i am using black gold and worm castings
for my mix. heavy on the castings from my worm bin.
hope this helps in some way.
Lrus007
ps. look at potting soil, if it has any wood chips in it do not buy it...
My therapist says I am a habitual liar and an attention seeker, therefore nothing I say/write is true and under no circumstances should I be believed nor held accountable for anything I say. all photo's are paintings
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The limits of Pro-mix
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCE0O3P ... mpu9m3vvwQ" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
This guy here has some interesting ideas on soil.
This guy here has some interesting ideas on soil.
The limits of Pro-mix
And loves wood chips but not mixed in the soil. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AVaFsORKhl8" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Butcher Bob
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The limits of Pro-mix
Really??...who's talking that shit?Dick Fein wrote:I have done 2 crops in amended pro mix bx.
Only organic nutrients were added. bone meal, blood meal, guano, worm castings. I did add some Cal Max when watering because they had yellow tips beginning.
I have found some opinions that say that is it, I can't use it any more.
What say ye?
To be blunt...if you have problems with ProMix, then you lack basic botanical knowledge. It is pretty much just peat and perlite. In your list of amendments, I see no K...if you got no K, you're going to have problems.
I've used pallets of the stuff and never had any issue with it. Most other "potting soils" use compost material, that I usually find wood chips, bark, and/or trash in....all of which are bad for growing cannabis. When I first started to grow, I was using soil from the backyard and Miracle Grow...a buddy saw this, laughed, and then turned me on to ProMix and Ionic nutes. The difference was un-fukking-believable.
The limits of Pro-mix
The guy in the post right above yours Bob. He has a 4 part series on soil building, and though he is a vegetable farmer his results are pretty impressive.
There is a common factor with this Doctors health advice and it is the mineral content of wood ash and we need to use more of it in our gardens and lifestyles. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CCt3l8Jqx0o" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
There is a common factor with this Doctors health advice and it is the mineral content of wood ash and we need to use more of it in our gardens and lifestyles. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CCt3l8Jqx0o" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Butcher Bob
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The limits of Pro-mix
The only things I see him mention are...
That the peat has no nutrients, which is true for our purposes...but in the long run is inaccurate. Eventually the peat decomposes and turns into organic matter, which is a component of soil, and releases the nutrients it holds. That point is way past when we use it for potting up plants, because it becomes too dense for our needs. Once it has decomposed that much, it needs to be mixed with soil to provide enough aggregate to aerate the soil. That's why many of us till our used potting soil into outdoor gardens.
The other point he mentions is the lime, saying it is needed for the peat, but not for soil...which is wrong. Any composting organic material, whether it be peat, leaves, or wood chips, raises acidity in the process...which lime is used to counter act. For farming, gardening, and lawn care, lime is a common amendment for when the soil becomes too acidic.
And remember, he is talking aboot non-cannabis plants. For cannabis, we benefit greatly from having a loose medium...growth is much more vigorous because the roots can easily penetrate it. Use some heavy compact soil and see how fast your cannabis grows.
Potash....a very good source of K. Another amendment commonly used on farms and in gardens. A good source of which are the ashes from your fire pit, provided you have one.
You don't need to go with Ionics specifically, any good nute package will work. I had good results with Botanicare products as well.
If you would like to continue working towards an organic soil, I recently posted this in a "Just add water" thread elsewhere...
Years ago I did a couple 'organic vs synthetic' trials. It was the first time I ever did an organic soil. There were countless 'recipes' to be found...which one to use?
So I did some academic research on organic soils and amendments. Then, armed with that info, I took another look at the recipes, compared and contrasted them, and formulated my own based on all the information I had looked at. I looked at the entire process as having three components, which together would have to provide everything the plant would need, organically.
The soil base:
3 parts Pro-Mix BX w/ mycorrhizae (for structure, and microbes)
2 parts Pro-Mix for Hanging Plants w/mycorrhizae (for structure, water retention, and microbes)
2 parts Used soil (for structure, and microbes)
1 part Worm castings (for moisture retention, micro-nutes, and microbes)
The soil amendments:
(per 16 gallons of soil base)
- 1 cup Bone Meal (for P)
- 1 cup Blood Meal (for N)
- 1 cup Kelp Meal (for K, and micro-nutes)
- 1 cup Granulated Lime (for time release ph control)
- 1 cup Alfalfa pellets (dissolved in water) (for N)
- 1/4 cup Epsom Salts (for magnesium, and sulfur)
- 10 ounces Pyroclay (for silica, and micro-nutes) <--used in trial #2, but not in #1
Additional amendment options:
- Dry-Bar Bat Guano (mostly for additional P, but has higher N content as well)
- Liquid Seaweed (for additional K, and micro-nutes)
- Fish Emulsion (for additional N)
- Molasses (to feed the soil microbes)
I mixed up the soil base and soil amendments, and let it 'cook' for a month...to let the microbe colony establish and begin breaking down the nutrients for the plants. The guano was scratched in when the plants were put to flower. The liquid seaweed and fish emulsion were kept on hand in case a need arose...I don't think I ever needed them during the trails. And I think I used the molasses just once, half way through flowering.
I'm not purporting this to be the 'miracle' soil...I'm just providing the information for you to compare with all that you have gotten already.
Everything listed I've seen at Walmart, except for the guano and pyroclay, which were attained at a grow shop.
That the peat has no nutrients, which is true for our purposes...but in the long run is inaccurate. Eventually the peat decomposes and turns into organic matter, which is a component of soil, and releases the nutrients it holds. That point is way past when we use it for potting up plants, because it becomes too dense for our needs. Once it has decomposed that much, it needs to be mixed with soil to provide enough aggregate to aerate the soil. That's why many of us till our used potting soil into outdoor gardens.
The other point he mentions is the lime, saying it is needed for the peat, but not for soil...which is wrong. Any composting organic material, whether it be peat, leaves, or wood chips, raises acidity in the process...which lime is used to counter act. For farming, gardening, and lawn care, lime is a common amendment for when the soil becomes too acidic.
And remember, he is talking aboot non-cannabis plants. For cannabis, we benefit greatly from having a loose medium...growth is much more vigorous because the roots can easily penetrate it. Use some heavy compact soil and see how fast your cannabis grows.
Potash....a very good source of K. Another amendment commonly used on farms and in gardens. A good source of which are the ashes from your fire pit, provided you have one.
You don't need to go with Ionics specifically, any good nute package will work. I had good results with Botanicare products as well.
If you would like to continue working towards an organic soil, I recently posted this in a "Just add water" thread elsewhere...
Years ago I did a couple 'organic vs synthetic' trials. It was the first time I ever did an organic soil. There were countless 'recipes' to be found...which one to use?
So I did some academic research on organic soils and amendments. Then, armed with that info, I took another look at the recipes, compared and contrasted them, and formulated my own based on all the information I had looked at. I looked at the entire process as having three components, which together would have to provide everything the plant would need, organically.The soil base:
3 parts Pro-Mix BX w/ mycorrhizae (for structure, and microbes)
2 parts Pro-Mix for Hanging Plants w/mycorrhizae (for structure, water retention, and microbes)
2 parts Used soil (for structure, and microbes)
1 part Worm castings (for moisture retention, micro-nutes, and microbes)
The soil amendments:
(per 16 gallons of soil base)
- 1 cup Bone Meal (for P)
- 1 cup Blood Meal (for N)
- 1 cup Kelp Meal (for K, and micro-nutes)
- 1 cup Granulated Lime (for time release ph control)
- 1 cup Alfalfa pellets (dissolved in water) (for N)
- 1/4 cup Epsom Salts (for magnesium, and sulfur)
- 10 ounces Pyroclay (for silica, and micro-nutes) <--used in trial #2, but not in #1
Additional amendment options:
- Dry-Bar Bat Guano (mostly for additional P, but has higher N content as well)
- Liquid Seaweed (for additional K, and micro-nutes)
- Fish Emulsion (for additional N)
- Molasses (to feed the soil microbes)
I mixed up the soil base and soil amendments, and let it 'cook' for a month...to let the microbe colony establish and begin breaking down the nutrients for the plants. The guano was scratched in when the plants were put to flower. The liquid seaweed and fish emulsion were kept on hand in case a need arose...I don't think I ever needed them during the trails. And I think I used the molasses just once, half way through flowering.
I'm not purporting this to be the 'miracle' soil...I'm just providing the information for you to compare with all that you have gotten already.
Everything listed I've seen at Walmart, except for the guano and pyroclay, which were attained at a grow shop.The limits of Pro-mix
I have many of those on hand and those values are very close to mine.
I had never heard of the alfalfa pellets before but I have been using my trim as mulch after processing it in ice water.
I am going to let these pots rest for a couple months before trying them again but thanks for the suggestions.
I had never heard of the alfalfa pellets before but I have been using my trim as mulch after processing it in ice water.
I am going to let these pots rest for a couple months before trying them again but thanks for the suggestions.
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Butcher Bob
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The limits of Pro-mix
I had maybe a dozen recipes I was looking at, all of them different...some ingredients I'd never heard of. So I read up on a bunch of organic soil info at .edu sites (mostly Michigan State's Ag. Dept.), and took another look at the recipes. Some had ratios that were way off, but most fell in a reasonable range. The nutrients were the common thread...the ingredients were just different. So I just tried to provide the needed nutrients with the cheapest, most common ingredients. I wasn't looking to come up with the "best" recipe, just a good one, that anyone could do.
I forget when I first learned aboot the alfalfa...but I do remember wondering why more organic soil recipes didn't make use of it. It is very cheap and is a very good provider of N.
I forget when I first learned aboot the alfalfa...but I do remember wondering why more organic soil recipes didn't make use of it. It is very cheap and is a very good provider of N.
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Lrus007
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The limits of Pro-mix
alfalfa has been used for roses a very long time.
i spread out a few bales around my fruit trees every spring.
after spring rains it feeds and mulches all summer.
i spread out a few bales around my fruit trees every spring.
after spring rains it feeds and mulches all summer.
My therapist says I am a habitual liar and an attention seeker, therefore nothing I say/write is true and under no circumstances should I be believed nor held accountable for anything I say. all photo's are paintings
People are born with the instinct to fight against their own death, to struggle with their last breath against even the most unavoidable and uncompromising ends.
People are born with the instinct to fight against their own death, to struggle with their last breath against even the most unavoidable and uncompromising ends.