myPlanetGanja.com

Well, I've read through it and I'm not sure what to make of it really. I'm not a lawyer, I don't play one on the internet, but the grand jury indictment seems to read as though Gypsy Nirvana is still facing quite the uphill battle if he does get extradited.

Although we may have not always seen eye to eye, I certainly do hope you're able to prevail in your efforts to avoid extradition and maybe one day be reunited with your wife and kids. Because if not, buddy, it looks like they're not gonna be content until you lose it all.

I was under the impression that back on British soil, one would be protected by the fact that this business was legal where it was based.

Apparently, that legality in the UK doesn't mean shit in the eyes of the US DOJ.

Certainly leaves one curious as the whom the unnamed parties may be, and holy damn. They're going all the way back to 2004?
Now, these are publicly accessible court records available from the US PACER (Public Access Courts Electronic Records) system, and since the cost was simply just 50¢, I thought I'd make them available to you.

Again, best of luck to you, Gypsy.

From the looks of it, you're gonna need it.

So what happened about this?

He was supposed to have his extradition hearing in May I read somewhere.

So is he now in jail in the US?

Or has he rolled and is now free and a confidential informant for the DEA?

GN is still in the UK.

He has his extradition trial on Thursday 20th July, at Westminster Magistrates Court in London UK (10 am) and could use some support if anyone wishes to attend.

He ain't rocking or rolling right now, as you would expect. And I would not expect he would ever be rolling on anyone, even if he could.

Its that money laundering "thingy" The U.S. is a real bitch about that.

Ever got divorced and took your pension fund and spent it before your completely disabled ex wife ever got her half?

The U.S. is the disabled wife.

The crimes they are alleging occurred in Maine, U.S.

Each jurisdiction gets and ajudication.

Sure hope he's able to escape this mess that is our US DOH J.

whats strange
the weed thing is from 2004, but the money thing is just a part of that time span, hows that meant? or why is there this time frame thats "not connected" to the business that was running in the same time frame

id think, that the money thing should also be set to 2004 ...

anyways, it makes no sense

I suppose they don't have the evidence to convict him of money laundering going back to 2004, and the evidence they are relying on for the money laundering charges in the indictment was provided by the people who got busted in Maine.

I had a look at his site, he posted something about the US Prosecutor talking about doing a deal where he only receives 7 months jail time, as he has already done 3 years or so in the Philipines.

I don't know what the Prosecutor would think about him continuing to "traffic drugs" into the US via his seed retailing site while all this is going on.

When did the alleged offenses in the charging papers occur? The statute of limitations finish line might not be far away.

<edit> OK I see the papers above, 2004 to 2013 then.

TheGhost wrote:I suppose they don't have the evidence to convict him of money laundering going back to 2004, and the evidence they are relying on for the money laundering charges in the indictment was provided by the people who got busted in Maine.

thats bit really plausible

as a business owner you must hold some business papers intact to 5 years , sometimes to 10 years, in the case that the state is testing your business (sorry dont know the right word for it) - where they check all bills and taxes and loans and insurances and all that paper crap ... , the stae can be in form of the irs for example or some other "buro" ...

I always thought that Plural of Mongoose was behind setting him up, but when he got out of jail in the Philipines someone asked him on icmag who he thought set him up, and he said he thinks it started with a single mother who was a member of icmag getting busted growing and LE threatened to take her kid unless she rolled, so she rolled and down came Rezdog and Dutchgrown and whoever else, who then rolled on Gypsy.

When that came out Seamaiden, who used to be a mod at icmag, and then got kicked off and became a mod at thcfarmer, suddenly disappeared from the boards.
A connection?

Gypsy also claimed on the pages of ICMag that his copy of the arrest warrant and extradition request forms had cited DG as rolling on him in Skype conversations which who knows from what I know of Skype they could have been eavesdropping on the accounts simply because of this back story on financials going all the way back to 2004?

I'm hopeful someone gets to update us as to what happens next cause if at the hearing they do rule to extradite with privacy laws such as they are in merry old England we'll probably not hear wordnone unless of course someone at icmag decides to let a thread stick around for more than a day

Yesterday the Judge in GN's extradition case heard both sides (prosecution and defense), and adjourned till 30th August when he will cast his verdict.

From how the proceedings went, it did look like the Judge was more in favor of not allowing the extradition because the US side was accusing GN of being involved in the cultivation since he was a seed dealer, by way of conspiracy. In reality these breeders or seed makers were all growing independent of any influence from GN, and way before they ever contacted GN to vend their seeds. GN had never set foot in Maine, never helped set any grows up there, so any conspiracy to create a crime on his part to break any laws there would be impossible to prove.

Due to there not being dual criminality with seed sales/possession between the UK and USA,the judge was finding it hard to find any criminality in what GN had been doing as a cannabis seed vendor.

And quoted straight from the horses mouth (GN's)

'I will write here about the summing up of my Final Extradition Hearing in Westminster Magistrates Court last Thursday before District Judge Zani.

I was represented by Mr Ben Cooper, and the Government (acting on behalf of the USA) was represented by Joel Smith.

Mr Smith briefly opened the case for the government, then I was called to give evidence. I adopted my statements as my evidence, then was cross-examined by Mr Smith. Legal submissions were then made by both parties, these lasting all day. The Judge then reserved judgement until August 30th.

My bail was varied so that the curfew conditions were deleted, and I was told that I could have the electronic ankle monitoring device removed, but if I wish to stay overnight anywhere else I should inform my lawyers so that they can inform the CPS and the court with the address, giving them at least 24 hours notice. Should the police wish to check on my presence at any other address, then I have a duty to present myself to them on the door-step.

The decision that DJ Zani will make will be either (1) to discharge me (in which case the Government may exercise their right of appeal); (2) to send the case to the Secretary of State for the Home Office (currently Amber Rudd) for her to order my extradition to USA (in which case I can appeal to the High Court if we have arguable grounds); or (3) should the Judge wish to invoke the Tolman procedure in respect of my abuse argument, he may further adjourn the case with respect to the US Attorney to answer the abuse points my lawyers have made (about my miss-treatment in the Philippines).

In terms of timescales, any appeals would probably not be heard until the very end of this year, so I am unlikely to be extradited before then, if at all.

It is difficult for me or my lawyers to give an opinion on which way the Judge's decision will go, but he did appear to be much more open to our arguments then we had anticipated.

I will be seeking some immigration advice in respect of getting my family (wife/kids) over to the UK from the Philippines, and could possibly get some legal aid to facilitate this since both my kids have British passports.'

The money laundering allegedly went on for a period of 7 months, and I expect the amounts were not that high, not in the millions anyway.

That might go in his favour, as it may not be classed as a serious enough offence to warrant extradition.

Could the time he spent in the Philipines immigration centre be classed as time served?

He wasn't directly imprisoned for the charges in the indictment, he was locked up on an immigration matter relating to the Philipines. Would they say this time in the detention centre had nothing to do with punishment for his alleged crimes?

Surprised the US is going to this much effort and cost to try and lock him up, considering that compared to what other crimes are going on in the US it is relatively minor by comparison.

TheGhost wrote:The money laundering allegedly went on for a period of 7 months, and I expect the amounts were not that high, not in the millions anyway.

That might go in his favour, as it may not be classed as a serious enough offence to warrant extradition.

Could the time he spent in the Philipines immigration centre be classed as time served?

He wasn't directly imprisoned for the charges in the indictment, he was locked up on an immigration matter relating to the Philipines. Would they say this time in the detention centre had nothing to do with punishment for his alleged crimes?

Surprised the US is going to this much effort and cost to try and lock him up, considering that compared to what other crimes are going on in the US it is relatively minor by comparison.

If the 'Conspiracy to Manufacture' charges are deemed as rubbish then the money laundering charges will be a moot point, and the amount was under 100k in M.O.'s that GN was entrapt to send stateside by one of the feds confidential witnesses, since the feds had hassled GN's UK bank to drop his account for processing said M.O.'s to get him to send them himself.

Time spent in the PI's was directly at the behest of the US Justice department, because they asked the Philippino Bureau of Immigration to pick him up on a 'Mission Order' (not any warrant), and keep him locked up because they said he was a fugitive from American justice, without warrant or trial. GN was a legal immigrant in the PI's with a permanent visa, which was acquired at great cost and he had no immigration or criminal case against him in that country.

It is a lot of fuss over nothing much, and I am surprised at the lengths the USA is going to, to try and get GN to face federal marijuana charges, in the USA.

I'm surprised too but this is the global war on drugs, and damnnit if GN is gonna keep selling them beans then GW Pharma is gonna keep having to wait for their medical monopoly

Once you factor in the obvious collusion between the US and the Filipino authorities to attempt an extra-judicial-rendition on GN, so as to illegally render him onto US soil just 10 days after his arrest in 2013,(attempted kidnapping) and the length of time this form of persecution has already gone on for (Passage of Time) The separation of family, the loss of business and liberty over the past 4 years, it all adds up to a lot of grief.

If GN is absolved of any criminal wrong-doing in this case, in the UK, he may well have a case to seek recompense for all the punishment he received without being served any warrants or indictments, arrested, then arbitrarily detained for 30 months, before being allowed to deport to the UK in March 2016.

Well I hope he beats the extradition attempt, and if he gets compensation for malicious prosecution or wrongful imprisonment or whatever, then all the better.

Well looks like Gypsy Nirvana has won his extradition case, the US could appeal it, interesting to see if they do. I don't think they would bother though.

Good!

At least someone updates us here. For a laugh, I tried logging in to ICMug or whatever it is the other day and discovered I'm still banned.

Reason - No reason
Date ban will be lifted - Never

Scared of a little cocktail prawn. Fuck me

Prawn Connery wrote:Good!

At least someone updates us here. For a laugh, I tried logging in to ICMug or whatever it is the other day and discovered I'm still banned.

Reason - No reason
Date ban will be lifted - Never

Scared of a little cocktail prawn. Fuck me

Join the club. I have been banned so many times from that site that I forget how many.
They even IP banned me once, but somehow I snuck back, and then they maybe thought I wasn't so bad after all, and un-IP banned me, but then banned me again shortly after.

There's no point joining that site anymore, it's days have come and gone, it's not the same as it once was, it's fairly sterile now. No trolling, no political discussions, nothing contraversial.

Sometimes I like to read the grow threads or vendor forums and have a look at the pix. I could create a sock, but honestly can't be fucked. Too much effort for the odd occasion a Google search takes me there . . .

25) I have considered the very capable submissions made by both parties but I am not satisfied that the prosecution have overcome the high hurdle necessary (criminal standard of proof) that the Dual Criminality has been demonstrated in respect of any of the conspiracy charges. It is common ground that in that event, the money laundering charge must also fail. Accordingly this extradition request must fail in relation to all charges.

54) However, for reasons set out above, the Dual Criminality challenge succeeds in respect of all 4 charges, and accordingly I refuse this request for extradition and order the discharge of GN from these proceedings. (Judge John Zani)

As GN says, 'The fat lady hasn't quite sung on my extradition case, just yet'. The USA can appeal, and they have less than 2 weeks to do that.

Thanks for the update DD. Glad to hear GN isn't likely to be renditioned to the US gulag.

Jesús Malverde wrote:Thanks for the update DD. Glad to hear GN isn't likely to be renditioned to the US gulag.

I will convey your best wishes to him Jesus.

It is unlikely that GN will get punted over the pond now even if the USA does manage to get an appeal together. I can't find a case where a British extradition Judge's decision was reversed upon appeal anywhere, can you?

If that does happen, here are the charges he will have to face:

Their case against GN was all conspiracy based.
Here are the 4 charges:

1. Conspiracy to traffic marijuana: max penalty 20 years custody.
2. Conspiracy to import marijuana: max penalty 5 years custody.
3. Conspiracy to export marijuana: max penalty 5 years custody.
4. Conspiracy to commit money laundering: max penalty 20 years custody.

I don't think that the Judge liked the fact that the charges talk about marijuana, when all it was about is cannabis seeds, which are legal in the UK. He was not trafficking 'erb, or growing it, or helping the breeders in Maine to grow it. In fact he had never even set foot in Maine USA, never even visited any of the grows that the cops busted in Maine that led them to him. And as for the money laundering charge, those funds were made legally from seed sales, according to British law.

Well I wonder now if the UK banks will give him credit card processing ability.

I used to order from there going back to SeedsDirect days, back when there was only SeedsDirect and Heavens Stairway and Mark Emery.

Always came in 10 or 11 days after sending off the International Money Order.

But now I think the only way to pay for seeds there is via cash in the mail, and that's too risky for me.

There are other options out there, I don't need to resort to sending cash in the mail.

I don't think Seedboutique will ever be the main player it once was, there is too much competition out there now, plus with the widespread legalisation in the US, probably the biggest market for seeds, they have access to clones and seeds from within country.

Gotta say though, it was a revelation when I first learnt you could buy these strains I had only seen pictures of in High Times, such as Skunk and Northern Lights, over the internet.

No more taking chances with bagseed that sometimes ended up as all hermies.

Glad to hear this.

I am of the opinion they already fuk'd him too much, for something we are in the process of making legal anyways.

Yep, bought my first seeds from Gypsy back in 2001. Did a bank transfer from Asia, if I remember correctly, and the seeds arrived a few weeks later. Those early seebanks and OG set me on the righteous path to indoor growing.

I've said it before: ICMag and it's sycophant censors can suck my stalk, but I'll never criticise Seeds Direct, as it was a stand-up business.

Suck your stalk?

I posted this in the other thread, since it looked relevant, as it does here too:

Eh, just had word that this war of legal attrition still goes on for GN sadly.

The USA has appealed against the decision of the British Judge DJ Zani to absolve GN of any wrong-doing by refusing to extradite him across the pond.

Now the appeal will be heard in the High Court by 3 other British Judges, and according to his lawyers it should be done and dusted within 2-3 months.

I've not been able to find any cases where a British Judges decision NOT TO EXTRADITE someone has been overturned on appeal in the High Court.

No new 'evidence' has been submitted by the US prosecutors. It seems that they are just going with the same old 'CONSPIRACY' angle, stating that Judge Zani erred in his judgement by not seeing any 'CONSPIRACY' in GN's business of buying and selling what is considered a legal product (Cannabis Seeds), under British law.

In 2011 two British banks that had been processing funds knowingly (and legally) from cannabis seed sales from GN's bizz suddenly refused to do it anymore, after happily processing them for many years.(most probably they were contacted by the feds and forced to stop processing GN's funds from seed sales). Within a few months this led to GN having a stack of m.o's he couldn't cash. He told DG about this problem, and she suggested that he send them to her to cash in Maine, where she said that she could get them processed for a 20% fee. Little did GN know that at that time DG was a confidential witness/informant for the feds who helped her set GN up with an entrapment for the laundering charge.

It's over 4 years now since GN was first arrested and detained in the Philippines on these ridiculous charges that would never come about in the UK since cannabis seed trading is perfectly legal under British law, and after all he is a British subject/citizen. At the recent extradition trial Judge Zani said 'If Mr Nirvana can sell these seeds legally, then he has to be able to buy them from somewhere'.

He remains on bail in the UK, without any real restrictions until this is finally resolved. In the unlikely event it does go 'tits-up' for him and the order NOT TO EXTRADITE him is reversed, then he too can appeal.

What did Gypsy Nirvana do to piss of the US?

They are sure putting in a lot of effort to go after him.

In regards to the conspiracy to manufacture cannabis I thought that was for selling seeds to people for the purpose of them growing cannabis.

Must be stressful this long drawn out business.

He didn't piss off the US. per se.

Law enforcement, Pigs, love the war on drugs. remember the the police state is an industry that creates crime. it is their power base. they depend on it.;
The US pigs actually like him , good career opportunities for them.



if it not a wrong, then the police-state legislator/lobby to makes it a crime.

surely you have a police -state there too. it's is omnipresent.

Yes, police state here to.

Tips for living in a police state:

Someone posted this on another site, and he said when he was young bikers said to him, don't be on the street after 6pm.

Which is true, don't be out after dark. In fact don't be on the streets at all unless really necessary.
Don't be a "head", that is someone they see enough to point out to their partner or comment on when they are driving past.
Of course this mainly applies if you are growing or selling.

2. If you are going to do something illegal like growing then do it by yourself.
Too many people have had partners bring them down.

3. If you are growing or selling then be "Joe Normal"; dress well but not so you look like a pimp, just don't look like a Narco or a stoner or an "alternative" person.

4. Stay off the radar, don't do anything to bring LEO to your house, no loud parties or domestic violence.

5. Don't associate with people who take drugs or commit crime and don't be known by those sort of people. Don't be part of a scene, keep your growing and smoking to yourself.

6. Never drive with weed in the car. I read nearly everyday about someone who was stopped in a traffic stop and LE found weed or other stuff in the car.
Keep it and smoke it at home. It doesn't leave the house.

7. Don't associate with druggies or criminals, don't be known to them.

Thank goodness weed's legal here now. I'd almost forgot how bad it can be.

I believe it is a mistake to think cannabis is legal. it will bite ya. It is not federally, and at the cali recreational prop 64 only lets the counties and municipals create there own draconian laws. and are doing so as i type this. Prop 64 creats more potential crime then it exonerated.

its illegal to grow your own in washington state still!

bentech wrote:its illegal to grow your own in washington state still!

Well people wanted "legal" and they got it. Who benefits?

Isn't legal at the minimum being able to grow your own and smoke it? If so then Washington state didn't get legal, they got something else foisted on them.

Maybe they didn't campaign for legal, maybe they campaigned on behalf of big business to be given a monopoly to grow and sell it

And at the maximum legal means you can grow as much as you want, unfettered by laws trying to control how you do it, and be free to sell it to whoever you want.

I hope it never becomes legal here, as that will take away the ability of the person who grows for their own use, and sells any excess, to make a few extra dollars to buy the things they otherwise couldn't afford.

Growing for your own use you should never get caught, unless you show or tell people, or you do things that will bring LE to your house, therefore it doesn't matter if it's legal or not.

Although here people have been busted after customs intercepted seeds they bought overseas, and notified LE. In the cases I have heard about, LE conduct a raid about 2 months after the seizure of the seeds, obviously hoping the person has managed to get some more seeds and has a grow going.

The reality here in Washington State is that almost nobody (nobody I am aware of) gets harassed or busted for growing a few plants now, even in their back yard. And we are working right now to change the law so that every adult can grow a few plants without having to worry about any potential legal repercussions. The biggest practical difference this change will make is that this will allow pot shops in place to sell cuttings and seeds, which is currently rather absurdly disallowed. I asked my favorite local budtender about buying seeded bud, and he looked at me like I was crazy. Then I showed him what ten seeds of the same varieties they sold were getting on the seed market. You could watch the light coming on. A seeded bud is, by that metric, worth many multiple times what an unseeded bud the same weight is worth. It is allegedly illegal to sell seeds through the rec system, but there is no prohibition against selling seeded buds. I think there's a real market opportunity there going begging.

smokebreaks wrote:Although we may have not always seen eye to eye, I certainly do hope you're able to prevail in your efforts to avoid extradition and maybe one day be reunited with your wife and kids. Because if not, buddy, it looks like they're not gonna be content until you lose it all.

Again, best of luck to you, Gypsy.

smokebreaks wrote:Sure hope he's able to escape this mess that is our US DOH J.