25

[ripper5]

The situation this week is what you get when 'faith' and 'belief' is held in higher regard than facts and evidence.


“The religious mind is primed to accept lies. Presented with an extraordinary claim, it does not demand extraordinary evidence, but instead engages faith to overcome skepticism. Their religion has taught evangelicals to accept, rather than to question.

Trump’s constant waterfall of outright lies landed on amenable minds. His support was greater among regular churchgoers than among lukewarm believers. The greater the faith, the more subordinate healthy skepticism becomes.

So the biblical fetish for totalitarians may have helped America elect its first.”

― Andrew L Seidel, The Founding Myth: Why Christian Nationalism Is Un-America

[bentech]

i read that unthough a 51 50 vote will not convict the twice impeached it will prevent him getting the presidential pension AND the freedom to ever run again...

[Intrinsic]

 Rather than blame the incompetent fool, I first have to ask...how in the fuk does such an unqualified individual get there? 
.
Yup that's says it all, rather than blame... deflect.

It's Because of people like YOU! Apologist, coming up with rationalizations like that. Deflecting from Trump's responsibility for the consequences HIS action.

It's not just his fault, Trumps is the victim Of circumstance... Blah blah blah blah blah

Yeah the underlying issue is people deflecting the blame from Trump. < cough>

Yer Kind of like that guy caught in Pelosi's office, now claiming it wasn't his fault, he just got pushed inside while looking for a bathroom. Lolz

[Butcher Bob]

This is why we should be careful of what we are told to believe...



...just a little satire...to lighten things up.

On to what I'm really talking aboot...

The woman shot, and sadly killed, while trying to smash through a door into the House floor...

Then she broken in with the mob yelling "kill them kill them

Seems to be a different version than the interview with a protester that stated she was just standing there, and then she was on the floor bleeding out...

At least we found out who shot her...a Capitol Hill police officer, who indiscriminately fired a round through a closed door.

And the people who died, I've read this morning the woman was trying to climb through a secure window when shot...

Here we have bits of "information" from probably five different sources...each makes claims of what we should believe. Who do you believe?...is anyone telling the truth? This can be difficult to determine when you let the "news" do the thinking for you. Luckily, sometimes we get footage...



She wasn't attempting to smash through a door. She wasn't attempting to enter the floor chambers. I didn't hear her, or the mob, or anyone yell "kill them kill them". She wasn't just standing there. The shot was not fired indiscriminately through a closed door. The window she was climbing through was not secured. It would appear our sources of "information" are often unreliable.

There are a lot of disturbing things in that video, but one disturbs me more than all of the rest. A Capitol Hill police officer intentionally shot and killed a citizen, in the nation's capitol building, who clearly had nothing in her hands, and was in front of a crowd of people, including numerous police officers mere feet away, who had just left their post were the woman was shot. Puts things on a Kent State level for me.



Prawn, you asked why I don't view this as Trump's fault, and I alluded to an underlying tinderbox. I'm basically a socioeconomic guy...are all the human beings treated like human beings? If not, then societal breakdown occurs, no matter what finally sets it off. Wolff recently discussed this, and he articulated it way better than I could...

[Intrinsic]

What??????? Ticky-tack
The POTUS's coup d'etat against Congress during the certification of a free election. That's not the worst for ya?

The President of the United States of America killed her, lied to her, could have told her the truth. Trump killed her.
Crocodile tears. Lafayette Square massacre.

Dude, the details of what happened .... fuck
It changes her being used as a pawn in Trump's coup to gum up certification of free election that he lost, How? What? Huh? How??

There are some constraints but if a death occurs while you commit certain Federal crimes, or a California crime, you are responsible for the death.
I'm no lawyer but is not a coup d'etat is a federal crime? Sedition?

25 then murder charges.

[Intrinsic]

Well since you think Trump was never fit for office then you're on board with the 25th? But wait you were against the first impeachment to remove him, but he's unfit for office, but don't impeach but he's unfit but don't impeach. No 25th but he's unfit but no 25th but he's unfit but no 25th.
Or ya Jes pissing again.
Let's have a little light fun let's talk about brutal killing. a little fun no about brutal killing. let's have a little fun let's talk about the worst thing I've seen. No let's laugh first.

But don't talk about the overturning of a free election and the potus's coup d'etat

[Intrinsic]

Hmmmm I jes read Congress has been assured by General milley that there are safeguards in place in the event Trump wants to use nukes. Something about unstable presidents

[Prawn Connery]

The window she was climbing through was not secured. It would appear our sources of "information" are often unreliable.

Mate, we're all looking at the same video, yes? That window had been smashed in – just like the one on the opposite side that still had part of its shatter-proof glass intact.

See 0:26-0:30 of the video, left-hand side.

And what were those windows next to? Two glass doors that had been locked and barricaded (just like the windows) to keep the protestors out.

And what was the woman doing? Trying to climb through the smashed window next to the locked doors.

I call that trying to climb through a secure window (that had been broken). And I stand by what I wrote. Because unless you are blind, the version of events I read – before you even posted that video – correlated with what acutally happened.

The only thing unreliable in this instance is your eyesight. How else to explain your denial of events?

[Prawn Connery]

Prawn, you asked why I don't view this as Trump's fault, and I alluded to an underlying tinderbox. I'm basically a socioeconomic guy...are all the human beings treated like human beings? If not, then societal breakdown occurs, no matter what finally sets it off. Wolff recently discussed this, and he articulated it way better than I could...

I know what you are saying. And I agree that there are always underlying reasons for events. They are not acausal. But Trump incited the people at this event – lit a match under the tinderbox, to borrow your vernacular – and so I very much believe he was part of the reason behind what transpired.

Now let's not be disingenuous and start splitting hairs or delving into semantics to define the term "cause". If Trump hadn't been squealing like a stuck pig since he lost the election fair and square – and everything else he did on top of it – then there is a good chance the Capitol event would not have happened the way it did.

Perhaps something else would have happened down the track. But this isn't a debate about crystal ball technology. It's a debate about whether Trump was responsible – in any way – for what happened.

FWIW, I'm a socioeconomic guy too. I was a finance writer for many years. My definition of "socioeconomic" and yours are probably not the same. You can "treat people like human beings" all you want – but it is not up to you to decide if you are treating someone like a human being or not – it is up to the person being treated whether they feel that way. Or not. And you're never going to get concensus on that. Some people are happy to be ruled. Others not. Some are social. Others not. Some are progressive. Others not. Some see the big picture. Others get bogged down in the minutiae.

We're all different. That's what makes us human beings. And it's not necessarily about how we're treated, because we all like to be treated differently. But I'm sure you know that already.

[Prawn Connery]

This is why we should be careful of what we are told to believe...



...just a little satire...to lighten things up.

Hey, I can appreciate satire. But a lot of what's in that video is complete bullshit. Satire, in case you're wondering, is usually based on truth – that's what makes it satire. Just like black comedy. Or all good comedy for that matter – there's always an element of truth in it.

Indeed, I wasn't sure if Americans knew how to do satire. And after watching that video, I'm still not convinced.

Don't worry my American friends – I'm being satirical.