the petro dollar

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Oldjoints

the petro dollar

Post by Oldjoints »

You never change things by fighting the existing reality. To change something, build a new model that makes the existing model obsolete.
-R. Buckminster Fuller

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the petro dollar

Post by Butcher Bob »

roller24 wrote:The Debt is merely the amount of currency in circulation.

In theory, everything purchased with the us dollar becomes collateral for the debt represented by the note.

...every thing you think you own, is actually the banks in legal title, and you have equitable title.
Not sure where yer getting this info Roller, but it is wrong. :p

US debt = $21.46 trillion......US currency in circulation = $1.67 trillion

The collateral for US debt instruments is the ability to collect future taxes. Currency are Federal Reserve notes, not US debt. The holder of the note, just like the holder of a mortgage, is due value from the note issuer, which in the case of currency is the Federal Reserve.

No bank has any claim to my house, my vehicles, or anything else that I own...I hold legal title to all of it. The only thing I have ownership of that is not truly mine, is the land that all my stuff sits on, which in actuality is owned by the government as evidenced by their ability to levy property taxes. Your statement only holds true for items that have outstanding debt on them.

Oldjoints

the petro dollar

Post by Oldjoints »

Actually most of the US debt is being covered by the Social Security Fund. Who knows what nightmare will be created once that fund starts to deplete......

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the petro dollar

Post by roller24 »

BB, I pulled that info out of my tin foil hat.
I sell you a car, you give me an IOU for 500$, then you give me a govt IOU for 500$. All I have still is an IOU, but I can't collect the value, I have to find some other chump who will accept it for something else. That is our monetary system. yay.

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the petro dollar

Post by Butcher Bob »

Oldjoints wrote:Actually most of the US debt is being covered by the Social Security Fund. Who knows what nightmare will be created once that fund starts to deplete......
"Most" is a stretch...
Who Owns the U.S. National Debt?
...but your point is still valid.
roller24 wrote:I sell you a car...you give me a govt IOU for 500$. All I have still is an IOU, but I can't collect the value, I have to find some other chump who will accept it for something else.
True enough...but that is by definition a monetary system. It all started with the goldsmith holding all the gold and distributing notes pledging that held gold. The key difference now is that you can no longer turn in those notes for the gold they represent. We moved from a physical monetary system to an imaginary monetary system. That is why the 'kill the Fed' and gold folks want to return to a physical based system...because imaginary money doesn't have any actual value.

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Post by Butcher Bob »

Butcher Bob wrote:...because imaginary money doesn't have any actual value.
This is why having oil denominated in USD is so important. Only being able to buy oil with USD gives the USD value. As other currencies are used, the value of the USD will start to erode.

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Post by bentech »

"That is why the 'kill the Fed' and gold folks want to return to a physical based system...because imaginary money doesn't have any actual value."

aside from creating more 'general welfare' than the agrarian world had seen in 10,000 year?


they could care less!

to a man all they want to do is destroy society
just when their isn't enough natural world to go around
that is feed everyone

they want what that will unleash
its the only fair world as far as their values are concerned...
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Post by bentech »

China has sold $3 billion of sovereign dollar bonds. This is only the third such move by Beijing in the last 14 years, and the first involving bonds with a 30-year maturity.

China sold $1.5 billion of five-year bonds at 3.25 percent, $1 billion of 10-year bonds at 3.5 percent, and $500 million of 30-year bonds at four percent, the Finance Ministry said on Friday, as quoted by Reuters.

China has made the sale at a time when yuan has depreciated 10 percent against the dollar amid an escalating trade war with the US. “For any other normal corporate borrower the decision might have been to stand on the sidelines and wait for the market to stabilize a bit, but China is a little bit of a different animal,” a banker who worked on the deal told Reuters.

Printing machine: US Treasury issuing more bonds to feed soaring debt but there are no takers
Beijing is the largest holder of US debt. As of July, China had $1.17 trillion invested in debt minted by the US Treasury.


https://www.rt.com/business/441146-us-t ... hina-sale/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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the petro dollar

Post by Dick Fein »

Looks like the end of the road.

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Post by Jesús Malverde »

China traded interest bearing bonds denominated in USD for USD that bear no interest, thus depriving themselves of the interest income. :facepalm:
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