I learned two things this season.

Roots · Post by **Roots** » Tue Oct 29, 2013 12:25 am

I use cal mag both indoor and out...growing in a recirculating reservoir is way different than self contained DWC buckets....I'm still working for the night so when I get back home I'll reply in more detail.

Roots · Post by **Roots** » Tue Oct 29, 2013 4:33 am

-I'm from Cali, brah. THE BEST PART OF CALI
-Sure I have an indoor grow - for the suckers. Me, I only smoke outdoor, 'cause unless the light source was the Sun, it just won't be as good, brah. I ALSO SAID IN THIS THREAD I PREFER INDOOR COOKIES
-OverGrow refugee and poster of grows for 10+ years. TRY 13
-Male growroom (If you have bred a reproducing stable strain, I'll be impressed - if you are a pollen chucker, I won't be).

NEVER SAID I WAS A BREEDER, I WENT AFTER POLLEN CHUCKERS MORE THAN YOU EVER WILL, I USE TO BE ONE OF THE BIGGEST ADVOCATES OF PRESERVATION AND HAVE BEEN BANNED FROM EVERY MJ SITE FOR GOING AFTER HACKS. IVE MADE SEEDS BUT JUST SIMPLE CROSSES, I KEPT ALL THE SEEDS TO MYSELF BECAUSE I DONT BELIEVE IN MAILING OFF UNSTABILIZED SEEDS ALL AROUND THE WORLD

So let's roll with it, teach. As your student, protocol dictates I be allowed to raise my hand and ask a question. To tell you where I sit before I tell you where I stand, me likey vertically lit RWDC. As someone who has managed 24 different strains at once, very successfully, one point of nutrient regiments that I am always fascinated in discussing with expert growers, such as yourself - ya know, to pick your brain and enlighten my humble one, is the core regime. Just the basics of the Primary/Secondary/Micro nutrients, no additives or supplements

So Teach, on your indoor big daddy DWC system, let me ask you the following:

-Concerning only your Primary, Secondary and Micro Nutrients, what are the ppm concentrations you mix to for each of the elements (ppms of N, P, K, Ca, etc.), and in what ionic form do you make them available in the rootzone?

CATIONS/POSITIVE CHARGE.....IT WOULD BE POINTLESS TO TELL YOU THE PPM OF EACH ONE BUT I CAN RUN AN AGGRESSIVE VEG PLANT AT WELL OVER 2000 PPMS, IN A SELF CONTAINED RES YOU CAN MIX THE FOOD FOR EACH PLANT/STRAIN DIFFERENT...SOME STRAINS CAN MAKE THE RES GO UP IN PPM AND OTHERS DOWN, JUST DEPENDS IF THE PLANT IS A HEAVY FEEDER OR NOT, PH WORKS THE SAME IN A SELF CONTAINED RES

-With that base, what do you shoot for as the starting pH of the nutrient solution, and at what pH do you consider that solution spent?

AGAIN DEPENDS ON STRAIN, I LIKE TO TRY EACH NEW STRAIN AT ABOUT 5.7 FOR VEG. SPENT? YOU CLEAN THE RES EVERY TWO WEEKS. OUR DWC STYLES ARE WAY DIFFERENT

-Would one find a bottle of Cal/Mag in use in your indoor hydroponic or dirt systems?

YOU NEED THE SECONDARIES RIGHT? IRON IN CAL/MAG IS THE THIRD SECONDARY.

I USE GH AT 1/3 STRENGTH, CAL/MAG FULL STRENGTH, PRO-TEKT AT FULL AND EITHER B'CUZZ GROW OR BLOOM AT FULL....WITH MY HARD WATER I ALWAYS USE PH DOWN BETWEEN 15-45 DROPS PER 3 GALLONS OF FRESH MIXXED NUTRIENTS...EACH BUCKET GETS ABOUT FOUR GALLONS AND THEY GET TOPPED OFF ABOUT EVERY 48 HOURS OR EVEN EVERY DAY WHEN THEYRE DRINKING IN AGGRESSIVE VEGETATION.....IM NO DWC EXPERT AND NEVER CLAIMED TO BE BUT IVE BEEN DOING IT SINCE 2002 AND EVEN HAVE A SPECIAL BUCKET THAT HAS BEEN PATENTED AND MY BUDDY AND I WENT HALFS ON THE PROTOTYPE, JUST ONE MOLDED BUCKET COST 30K, WHEN WE START BUYING THEM BY THE 1000's THEYLL COST ME ABOUT $7 EACH

Roots · Post by **Roots** » Tue Oct 29, 2013 5:22 am

Sorry for the shitty looking reply, fat fingers and iPads don't mix.

Cat Jockey · Post by **Cat Jockey** » Wed Oct 30, 2013 1:28 pm

Ya know, I'm just having trouble working up the motivation to go through this thread. Just have a tough time staying motivated to argue shit on the internet, anything, these days. Even if I am right. I need to, it is only right to support my claims - I'll get to that. Plus, all that crashin' all those years on different shit going way too fuckin' fast, lookin' for shit that wasn't there, has caught up with me. Haven't been able to spend much time sitting in a chair, or doing much else but enjoy a life of pain the last few days, so ...

One question I saw as I scrolled down, was about why greenhouse and containers. The containers should be obvious. I don't care what your light source is. If you do not have FULL control over your rootzone, you are not going to reach full, fuller, fullest, most, bestest genetic expression for your genes and your growing area.

I suppose, with again not really reading, that you wonder why I would advocate the shading of some of that Sun and how that could possibly be better for quantity and quality of yer crop? So asketh the lamenter of purpling outside of his control?

One thing an indoor grower understands, or should, is trade-offs. A lot if Sun Worshippers don't - they see the rapid growth the sun provides and draw conclusions to the end - better (more potent) bud. That is what Dogma will do to one - make them believe and insist they are right without an open minded investigation, first. An unwillingness to correct themselves or their phrasing.

Them Sun Cult folks, well they are on my radar outside the realm of marijuana cultivation. They are very literally, Sun Cultists, behind some of the major, established power structures of the world, for a long time. Perhaps my beef with them in the real world on different issues has spilled into this thread?

Follow your logic out to see the point I am making, Roots. According to the Ganja Sun Worshippers, without full, unadulterated, unfiltered sunlight, you are just pissing in the wind. And any filtration you perform on that light comes at cost to your harvest potency.

That's where the trade-offs come in. Follow your logic. Sure, my not really reading your posts after the first one, that was just so factually incorrect, didn't need to go into the d squared shit for outdoor - but, instead of the change in d being from the top of the plant to the bottom, but from the top of your plant, way the fuck down there at sea level, and my 'higher than you' ass 10,000' above you, well, it still ain't much considering the light source's distance, but trust me, 10,000' squared in the denominator makes a difference. My pale skin ass, and many not so pale skinned people will tell you how much easier it is to get sunburned at altitude (not just closer, but atmosphere lets in more up here).

I notice, so will yer girls up here. Theorhetically, then, any weed grown outdoors in Colorado should kick the shit outta any Cali, lowland weed. I'm closer to the Sun, and you have more of the Sun filtered by the atmosphere. That simple, you outdoor snobs, right?

Of course not. That's because it ain't just light that gets you the digity dank. Atmosphere and rootzone conditions are the other two components. I'll take a little sacrifice in light to gain a more complete control over the other two, any day of the week, including Sunday.

Which is what greenhouse container growing does for ya ...

Cat Jockey · Post by **Cat Jockey** » Wed Oct 30, 2013 1:31 pm

One last thing on the three questions I posed. It is the last two I am primarily interested in, starting with wondering whether or not you have a bottle of Cal/Mag on your indoor shelf, and if so, why?

Roots · Post by **Roots** » Wed Oct 30, 2013 3:57 pm

I answered the Cal-Mag question twice.

As someone who has been making full melt hash from 20 plus different outdoor grows and even more indoor rooms one thing I have seen is that the heads are always bigger in the outdoor runs, I catch the FMCD in the 90u with outdoor material and I catch the FMCD in the 73u with indoor, this pretty much holds true with all strains regardless of who grew it.

jesus · Post by **jesus** » Wed Oct 30, 2013 4:57 pm

"We found that the direct UV-B levels at 8,500 feet in Vail, Colorado, were approximately 60 percent higher than at sea level in New York," said Darrell S. Rigel, MD, the lead author of the study. "In addition, the direct UV-B levels in Vail were the same as those in Orlando, a site nearly 775 miles closer to the equator."

And its the amount of atmosphere between you and the sun, not the 10,000 less feet that really make a difference out of 93 million miles.

The other point being that Orlando is at or close to sea level and gets the same UV as practically any place in Colorado.

I don't care what your light source is. If you do not have FULL control over your rootzone, you are not going to reach full, fuller, fullest, most, bestest genetic expression for your genes and your growing area.

As I stated control is just an illusion anyway. Besides that there was another study not too long ago that shows plants send out "feeler" roots to judge the amount of space they have to grow in so you could say that if theyre in a container they will never reach "most bestest" genetic expresssion anyway[1]. Then there is just the simple logical argument that cannabis didnt evolve in containers so you will never get close to that anyway.

1. http://esciencenews.com/articles/2012/0 ... oot.matter" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I suppose, with again not really reading, that you wonder why I would advocate the shading of some of that Sun and how that could possibly be better for quantity and quality of yer crop? So asketh the lamenter of purpling outside of his control?

I asked and I havent been the one lamenting purpling.

Now I havent said you cant grow great weed indoors. You can. But your argument for the best weed indoors or in a greenhouse is pretty weak. You seem to have taken it personally and there isnt really a need to. Grow however you want.

As far as controlling the rootzone, I wouldnt need to, my garden soil is awesome and only getting better every year.

For me the biggest advantage of growing indoors/greenhouse would be weather...freak storms, too much wind etc. Indoors just makes for prettier weed, not the most genetically expressed.

As far as being a sun worshipper. Maybe. But I'm not hiding it behind Jesus. Seems to me that youre the one with the most dogma and the far less open mind.

Roots · Post by **Roots** » Thu Oct 31, 2013 2:47 am

I wouldnt need to, my garden soil is awesome and only getting better every year.

That's all that really matters is that you're happy with your grow and you try to learn and improve every time.

Learning outdoor growing is harder IMO because you only get one chance to learn from your garden a year and there's lots of factors you have no control over or limited control over.

I disagree about indoor looking better, the majority of outdoor you see on the streets looks like crap, but outdoor can look just as good if not better than indoor.

jesus · Post by **jesus** » Thu Oct 31, 2013 9:10 am

You must not get many storms over there.

Butcher Bob · Post by **Butcher Bob** » Thu Oct 31, 2013 10:51 am

Nice dick swingin contest.

Did someone say black leaves?...